I have a friend who lives on the West coast of the US who refers to me as “buddy” a lot, and I don’t mention it, but it gives me the ick (she knew me pre-transition). I think she just uses it like a gender-neutral word for anyone (the way “dude” and “bro” ca be used sometimes), but I’m triggered, lol 😅
In public / with people who never knew me before transition, people will often refer to me and whoever I’m with (they’re usually women) as “ladies” (ironically my sister-in-law hates how often she is called “ladies” when she’s around me, lol).
On the phone or individually people often refer to me as “dear”. In the South, I got a lot more “sweetie”, “honey”, and even “sweet girl” and “good girl”.
What have your experiences been like (before, during, and after transition)?
@dandelion When I’m out with my mum I get ‘ladies’ a lot and every time it makes me feel like I’m at some kind of formal debutante ball. 😅
On rare occasions I’ll get a “ma’am” from strangers, and I’ve got one friend who will give me an occasional “darling”. But aside from that, nothing but my regular name.
And the only time I’ve gotten “ladies”, it was the waiter addressing me and my masc/NB partner during an anniversary date. That wasn’t fun for anyone.
Oof.
One of the times I got a “ladies” I was hanging out with a closeted transmasc friend and they were caught as collateral damage. (To be fair, he is extremely feminine, wears feminine clothes in pastel colors, wears feminine jewelry and earrings, and he hasn’t socially or medically transitioned at all, other than to ask the local trans groups to use he/they pronouns for him.)
But it still really sucks, I feel like I’m failing in that moment - there isn’t an easy way for me to defend my friend without awkwardly outing him and needlessly alienating a cis person who could not have possibly known he was a closeted transmasc person.
I also get uncomfortable when he goes into the women’s restroom with me - like, they are asking me to use “he/they” pronouns for him, but he’s also going to go in the women’s restroom with me? 🤷♀️ I dunno, it can create some cognitive dissonance for me, even if I also understand being closeted means you are making these kinds of choices.
But I try to be understanding, I know it’s hard to come out of the closet and actually transition - hopefully he does soon.
I often get called “ladies” when I’m out with my wife and we’re doing women coded activities like shopping for makeup or clothes. Its nice. Most of my friends just call me my name, which I like. I picked a good name.
When I’m out alone I get they/them’d from strangers who try to be supportive, and it hurts a little. Not as much as on the phone when I usually get sir’d. I despise that word. That word sounds contemptuous to me under all circumstances.
Before transition… I try not to think about those times lol
Pre-transition: “bro”, “dawg”, “bruh”, “bruu”, “broseph”, “dude” from my friends, endearingly and ironically (I assume) since I’ve always been effeminate. From strangers mostly just “hey! you!” Some people said “brother” unironically and 🤮 unfriended instantly
Currently: when I’m alone I get “buddy” and “sir”, which is weird because basically nobody referred to me as sir pre-transition. But besides that, there’s a lot less direct references to my gender. When I’m with other girls it’s always “ladies” at least.
I hope to someday pass, sounds nice
since i live in germany, i don’t get any of these very often. it’s quite unkommon to use such phrases to adress someone in german. at least in my circles. if you’d approach a friend of yours with “mein*e freund*in” (my friend), they’d probably ask you what tf you want of them. it’s not really casual. “bro” is in use but mainly with younger people?
some of my queer friends use “girl” or “diva” for me tho. if speaking english. outside of that specific context “diva” would be a bit of an insult in german. :)
i am still amused about people at work standing in the frame of my office door, asking me for Mr. Soandso. i then smile at them and say “yes come in. that’s me.” if people don’t get visibly confused, i don’t feel very misgendered, bc i am playing a role. and when they are it’s just super affirming. they are criticizing my performance but affirming my gender. :)))) (need to make it official soon, yeah.)
ja, when people are confused by how you look or can’t see a many anymore, you should make it official soon 😅
In Germany aren’t professional titles quite common, like “Herr Doktor Professor” kind of stuff? Or is that just in a limited context of a workplace or particular job?
Other commenter already noted workplace tendencies, I would like to expand on other parts of life:
Most institutions/corporations insist on you picking a title, though some offer neutral options.
For people you know, it’d be awkward to always adress them at full length, first name is usually enough. This is especially fun whenever you try to greet someone formally when you have just had a nice chat with them about the weekend.
i guess in medicine and law that’s still in. :)
The traditional and formal way would be to address someone as “Professor/in Müller” or “Herr/Frau Doktor Müller” but lately no one knows anymore and everyone makes backflips adding in all the titles and honorifics, when trying to be formal, resulting in “Herr/Frau Professor Doktor Müller” or the like. esp. in medicine people will be upset if you dropped the title.
i just used Herr or Frau + Surname (mr./ms.) for my teachers in uni (that was in the humanities). in science and tech people would just call each other by their first names afaik. (note all of these are tendencies)
but a lot of these gendered and neutral words that are used in english quite often have no good equivalent in german, i think. if talking to someone casually, we do not usually call them a lot by words, that illustrate our relationship. (like bro, bestie, girrrrrrrl, son, …) in greetings/openings it’s the name plus maybe horifics and titles. there exist some like “young man”, “my friend” (usually male) or “lady” …, yeah, but i feel this is what old people or vendors use. i cringe at them. ;)
yeah, I’m familiar with the way “Jungs” is used, for example. Can’t think of a direct female-equivalent, but I’m not native 🤔
Makes sense that it’s mostly formal titles. I think I learned about this mostly in the context of navigating university bureaucracy from the perspective of a professor.
Technically (the best kind of correct), the female equivalent for Jungs would be Mädels, but it’s hard to get right.
I’d only use it for a group of girls I’m a part of, and have only heard it used that way. Imagine: “Ich treffe mich heute mit meinen Mädels”. (eng.: “I’m going to meet up with my girls.”).
I hope this translates well enough to convey my impression that if somebody else uses it, it’s inappropriately close language for somebody they may not know that good.yeah, I think that comes across - “Jungs” also feels weirdly intimate / familiar, like “my bros” or something, or “my boys” …
Thanks for introducing me to Mädels, it’s really helpful to actually talk to someone familiar with the language - I always struggle in my adoption of German because of lack of social context and use. It has really declined over the last 5 years, I’m afraid, I have probably slipped from a B-1 to more like an A-2 level or less 😞
yeah, I think that comes across - “Jungs” also feels weirdly intimate / familiar, like “my bros” or something, or “my boys” …
Yes, I agree. I’ve actually only ever encountered it in family situations, like when somebody has multiple male kids, or in school.
Thanks for introducing me to Mädels, it’s really helpful to actually talk to someone familiar with the language
It’s my pleasure, I’d happily offer my services as a native speaker. I fear that the same is happening to the French I learned until I finished high school.
oh yeah i forgot “jungs” exists. i associate it with sports and other heavily homosocial contexts. female equivalent would be “mädels”. i guess “mädels” is gaining acceptance? hm.
i hate both. i may not be the most representative speaker of german. if i had something to say everyone would be addressed with just “hey” or “ummm”, depending on if you gonna ask a question. (for all the languages) 😆
I found myself very avoidant of gendered language when I was pre-transition, but once I transitioned it was a complete 180 - now I recognize how important and affirming gender can be, so I’m a big fan of gendered language (when used appropriately, obvi).
Girl, bitch, dude (not my fave, but I can deal).
One friend answers my calls, “What’s up bitch, getting that pussy pounded?” in reference to Adam Sackler from Girls, lmao.
lol, Adam is such a crazy character 🙃
I had a harder time dealing with “dude” early in transition, but since I no longer look like a dude, I tend to be aware that it’s not intended to misgender me, etc.
I don’t think I’ve been called bitch, but my partner and I both call one another “girl” for emphasis 😅
Friends?
hm?
