I think you have a fundamental misunderstanding about the point of a retaliatory military strike. The tit for tat bean counting with human lives isn’t even a large part of the calculus ultimately.

Not retaliating is seen as a sign of weakness which would serve to undermine NATO’s military stance of absolute first strike authority at anytime for any reason. Allowing Iran to attack US troops without a military response is relinquishing, in some small way, the US backed monopoly on violence. Right, wrong, or indifferent that is simply not something that will be allowed to happen.

I really hate the destruction or attempted destruction of art in order to bring awareness to a social cause. I get in this case the painting is highly protected, but there have been plenty of other instances where this has happened to other art where that wasn’t the case.

Not only are you a self-entitled piece of shit for tying to destroy something that is on display for public enjoyment, but you are virtually guaranteeing that anybody who didn’t already agree with you won’t take you seriously because you are acting like such a piece of shit.

Seriously, there are a lot of legitimate reasons for civil disobedience and public protest. This is not the way to go about that, and if you think it is then fuck you in particular.

Edit: I didn’t think this was going to be such a divisive issue. After some further research I am retracting my earlier statement about other art being damaged in these protests because I don’t see much evidence for that after all. It seems like these protestors are often targeting art they know will get maximum media exposure without causing lasting damage.

HOWEVER, I still think this type of action is counterproductive when you are trying to, hopefully, win over people that either do not support or are not aware of your message. Collective action is an effective means to make change in society. I am, again, not disputing that. I just think that if the goal is to gain broad support for your cause you need to choose targets that are more representative of that cause; rather than art, which does get media exposure, but which ultimately serves to obfuscate or overshadow the true purpose behind your protest. Being savvy about your target audience goes further and deeper into the social zeitgeist than simply getting headlines for being angsty.

To be fair that person did actually invite me to critique them. I wouldn’t have invested that much energy into responding otherwise.

Nevertheless, I don’t envision getting in any disputes with you where you literally ask me to publicly dress you down. So I think you’re safe 😅

It’s kind of sad to see someone who has such a good grasp of the English language waste it on going on a wild diatribe

I appreciate that, thank you. You’re quite the wordsmith in your own right. With that being said, I still don’t like you.

I only wish that you become a better person and grow out of this eventually.

Ditto. It would seem there are two points on which we can agree.

I won’t belabor this conversation anymore. I said my piece, and you said yours. Therefore we are at an impasse. I don’t hate you, but I don’t respect you either. My guess is you probably feel the same. If we each consider the other to be a fool’s messenger then at least we have parted on common ground.

Sure, all of these comments are a fantastic example of the “other-ing” of Palestinians, while reinforcing and white-washing Zionist ideology.

• You reference the birthrate of Palestinians followed by the subtle inclusion of the pronoun “them” or “these people” to indicate exclusion, isolation, and a removal of identity.

• In that same comment you imply that it is unjust or unethical for Palestinians to fight for their own culture or statehood while tacitly ignoring the fact that the post-WWII Zionist movement regularly used terrorism which they justified via ethno-supremacist ideology and a perceived divine right in order to claim land that was already occupied. This is so laughably hypocritical that no good faith actor would make such a fallacious argument.

• You argue that it is reasonable for Israel to use whatever cruelties they deem necessary in order to maintain the sanctity and security of their ethno-supremacist state. This includes indefinite detention and support of a crypto-fascist strongman leader. The reasoning you provide is “well other countries do it to”. Yes, the most famous of which was Nazi Germany. It is not a mistake or merely a coincidence that Israel employs many of the same tactics that were used by Nazi Germany as there is a strong historical link between modern day Likud and Lehi who repeatedly sought to form an alliance with the Third Reich.

• This same link between Lehi’s support for National Socialist ideology and Lehi’s influence on modern day Likud also provides historical context surrounding the justification for and continued expansion of settlements for Israeli Lebensraum.

• Curiously you do not see the hypocrisy with supporting any and all Israeli “security measures” when that was precisely the justification that the Third Reich gave for preserving the pure Aryan heritage of their own ethno-supremacist state after the crippling sanctions that were imposed upon the Weimar Republic after WWI.

• You paint Hamas as common thieves for having the audacity to sell HEBREW ARTIFACTS as though they have no right to even touch such holy relics from a superior culture. I’m taking some liberty here because while you did not say that directly, I am comfortable asserting that you certainly implied it along the way.

• You also fail to mention that Israel has repeatedly destroyed cultural heritage sites, and continuously attempts to rewrite history by dead-naming anything that does not fit with the perception of an exclusively Jewish historicity in the region.

Beyond all this though, I find you to be ethically bankrupt, bigoted, hypocritical, and proud of supporting the same kind of behavior that you would find abhorrent if it were being done to you. Anybody who supports the mass killing of civilians over religious, ethnic, or socioeconomic differences I consider to be sociopathic and evil. It doesn’t matter what the historical context is, that behavior is unacceptable. I don’t give a fuck what Abrahamic religion they subscribe to, or which god they think gave them the go ahead. It is wrong, it will always be wrong, and continuing with more wrongs only leads to even more evil. So for those reasons I find your positions to be morally repugnant, and worthy of scorn.

^ and this person openly supports the continuation of the in-group vs. out-group apartheid ideology that is being used to justify the mass murder and forced relocation of civillians in the name of Israeli Lebensraum.

Probably shouldn’t be throwing stones from your glass house there sweetheart 😘

Abiding by a set of ethics dictates doing your part even when the power of that individual action may be small. Collective actions on ethical principals is what changes the world, but doing so requires persistence in the face of overwhelming adversity.

Everybody can do something by boycotting companies who are supporting the Israeli occupation. Any economic impact, no matter how small, adds up over time. Whatever you can do to negatively impact Israel’s economic viability is worth your time.

https://bdsmovement.net/

Wait until you read about the Samson Option…

restoring the ethnic makeup of geographic areas to the way they were in a history book

Jesus fucking christ, how do you think you have the moral high-ground when in the process of exhibiting your smug, superiority complex you are criticizing the Palestinians for trying to do the exact fucking thing that the Israeli’s already did. Don’t answer that because I know whatever you are going to say is going to be precisely the kind of sick, demented justification that has allowed this conflict to continue for as long as it has in the first place.

^ This is the correct answer.

You made a whataboutism argument that flagrantly flies in the face of the core point, which is that Israel’s government & military are currently controlled by a radical right wing, crypto-fascist, ethno-supremacist, and hyper-religious political party that has members who have OPENLY AND PUBLICLY SUPPORTED ETHNIC CLEANSING. Why you feel the need to counter that point with, but, but, but, IT’S NOT AS BAD AS MOSUL is truly just frustratingly stupid. I don’t support the mass killing of civilians in their own homeland anywhere in the world. Why is that so fucking hard to understand?

the sentiments on this site are no longer representative of truth

You are not the arbiter of truth.

or popular opinion as dissent is being filtered out.

The popularity of an idea has absolutely no bearing on its merits or validity.

You made a whataboutism argument that flagrantly flies in the face of the core point, which is that Israel’s government & military are currently controlled by a radical right wing, crypto-fascist, ethno-supremacist, and hyper-religious political party that has members who have OPENLY AND PUBLICLY SUPPORTED ETHNIC CLEANSING. Why you feel the need to counter that point with, but, but, but, IT’S NOT AS BAD AS MOSUL is truly just frustratingly stupid. I don’t support the mass killing of civilians in their own homeland anywhere in the world. Why is that so fucking hard to understand?

the sentiments on this site are no longer representative of truth

You are not the arbiter of truth.

or popular opinion as dissent is being filtered out.

The popularity of an idea has absolutely no bearing on its merits or validity.

This is an excellent reference. Very cogently used as well I might add. Avatar the Last Airbender was truly ahead of its time, and one of the greatest pieces of children’s media ever made in my humble opinion.

Great points. Appreciate the insight 👍

Yeah, I really don’t have a sufficient answer for that question either…

One thing I do believe is that the only effective way to combat the really dangerous and addictive drugs (fentanyl & meth mostly) is to increase the social safety nets that give people a no questions asked way to exit that life. People hate this reality in the United States because as someone very wise once told me, “people don’t like seeing other people get free shit”, especially if they view those people as weak-willed criminals. The problem with that thinking is it is significantly more expensive economically to allow the cycle of abuse to continue rather than effectively subsidizing their way out of it as soon as possible.

The reason we have these problems on such a profound scale in the United States is precisely because of the fact that we live in a society that is overcome with closeted hopelessness. No access to universal healthcare, higher education, or a sense of community that doesn’t revolve around either work or fundamentalist religion. I could go on for days about this issue, it’s causes, and potential solutions. But ultimately what it boils down to is that it is the symptom of a profoundly sick society that for mutliple generations has prefered to sweep the problem under the rug, while simultaneously trying to punish its way out rather than dealing with the root causes. Until we are willing to try something new the cartels will only get stronger and more savvy, while the drugs get more sophisticated and addictive.

Is there though? The difference in Mexico is the sheer amount of power and money that the cartels possess. These aren’t just gangs like MS-13. They are full on paramilitary organizations with billions of dollars in capital that stretches through just as many legal business interests as illegal ones, connections to the highest levels of government, and most importantly the kind of social control over the public consciousness that borders on collective psychosis due to the sheer degree of constant heinous violence.

I really wonder if we have gone past the point of no return with this issue where the only solution is open warfare with the cartels. I have spent A LOT of time thinking about this issue over the years working on the legal & illegal side of the trade. I know it seems insane, but I truly believe it may get to that point.

In my younger years I was 100% on-board with the legalization of all drugs. Now after seeing the the damage that was caused by the legal opioid crisis, and the even greater damage that is likely to be caused by the fentanyl scourge…I am not so sure. The greed motive from profiteering off human suffering is simply too great. Mix that with regulatory capture and legal government corruption in the form of lobbying and you have a truly terrifying recipe for disaster. I am just not sure what the solution is anymore, but the damage and the violence is getting worse. Something needs to change. Maybe that starts with popular uprisings as you said, but the kind of prolonged violence that will be necessary to accomplish that end is hard to imagine.

Correct.

This makes no sense for “Patriots” to do.

It sure does when you realize the thing these Republicans are pleading fealty to is Donald Trump who is a tin-pot dictator hopeful that has repeatedly cucked himself to Vladimir Putin.